In the spring of 02, Nicole, my beloved cat companion, was given prednisone for an ear inflammation. It calmed the inflammation but left her in a kind of psychotic state-restless, paranoid-for 3 days.
When the inflammation flared up again in the summer of 03, she was diagnosed with autoimmune disorder (which I now question). Reassured she wouldn't experience the earlier psychosis, on Aug 6/03, I reluctantly but desperately agreed to a steroid shot and Nicole's life was changed forever.
For 5 days she was calm, not scratching her ears. I was ecstatic! Then the scratching came back with a vengeance-she tore at her neck and head. She became terrified-hissing and running and hiding, even from from Micalen, her big brother, who she adored.
I began working with a holistic vet and for the next 5 and a half yrs, a raw meat, no grains, natural anti-inflammatories, immune modulation products (transfer factor, moducare, etc) regiment kept the itching somewhat manageable.
But the paranoia was irreversible. Only when she was tucked hidden at the back of or in our bed or grabbed up in my arms could she look out at her otherwise frightening world and purr contentedly with all her little heart.
In the early morning of Dec 7/08 Nicole died while I slept restlessly beside her. I woke up at 820AM to the agony of not being able to hold and comfort her while she took her last breath.

Nicole's death rocked me to the core of my being. Disillusioned much earlier in my life, I lost my faith and felt a common bond with other atheists. I'd become resigned reluctantly to the thought that life dies with the body and hopes for an afterlife was simply wishful thinking. But the thought of never being with Nicole again, and worse, the thought that her hidden, small world filled with fear was all she would ever experience was too much to bear.
I began imagining her in a special place where she was tenderly cared for, growing steadily and surely stronger in her body and mind, no more crippling fear or tormenting itch, joined and reconciled with Micalen, who died 2 years before her. And I would be with her forever when my time to die came. I thought, if it's just a dream, my dream can die with me.

But I want to share what others have called 'signs'. A few weeks before Nicole's death, I dreamed about Sasha, my little girl (cat) who died on May 5/03. In my dream, I held her in my arms and then someone took her from me, her claw caught and I said, "Don't hurt her." I woke up. I'd desperately wanted a dream of her when she died- but nothing, and there was only silence when I sat by her grave. I had to wait about 5 and a hlf years for my dream of her come to me so unexpectedly.

A few days after Nicole died, it started snowing and it piled up about 2 ft over her grave. And the snow shaped in a form that looked exactly like Sasha. The amazing thing is that Sasha died in Edmonton, Ab where we used to live and it had unexpectedly snowed on the day she died. I buried Sasha under a blanket of snow in a little stand of spruce trees in Edmonton. Nicole is buried here on Mudge Island, BC where we now live, in our garden, surrounded by cedars. It's uncommon here to snow and if it does the rain washes it away rapidly. The snow lasted for about 3 and a hlf weeks, with Sasha's image present. And incidently, Sasha and Nicole were both born on May 17, 11 years apart.
I'd love to hear of others' signs of their babies, if you care to share. Thank you all for this place, your words of comfort, and our shared love and grief for our babies.

Thank you for sharing your story. We learn so much from others experiences..sometimes it helps other babies in the future.

I loved your story about Sasha's image in the snow...do you have a picture of that?

I am so sorry Nicole had to go through all that. And, for it to seem all was going to be okay then dramatically turn around like that.....just absolutely devastating.

She was next to you when she passed..and I am sure there was no other place she would have rather been.

It does help to think about being reunited one day...in a place with no illness and only happiness exists. It doesn't hurt to imagine such a place.

What a precious girl. It sounds from your story that she was about 11 years old or a little older?
My last boy was over 16 when illness overtook him with devastating results and an ER visit I could have nightmares about.

I know having them is worth everything we go through but it is okay to admit it is really hard going through it all, especially when there is a point there is no cure...that for me is always the hardest thing to accept.

I'm sure you will hear here of other "signs" as I have read about them. I don't have one to share. The best I can do is now when I look into my boy's eyes in any picture, I feel him looking back at me and I feel a connection between us while doing this. At first, I didn't have that feeling but now I do.

But I have read many stories here about "signs" that are beautiful to read and I am sure you will be visited soon as we all like to share a positive experience...that helps us all.

It is so interesting that Sasha and Nicole had the same exact birth date, 11 years apart. I think if mine had been like that....I would be looking for signs of reincarnation of the older one in the younger one.

Hugs to you and your Angels Nicole and Micalen and Sasha.

Judy

Wow....Nicole's Mom, those are two powerful stories, in so many ways....so much so that I'm laying aside my mountain of work here to reply. But first and foremost, please accept my sincere sympathies and empathy for the transition of your sweet baby, Nicole. My heart goes out to both you and her, for all that she had to endure.

I wish I'd had some way of knowing what you'd been going through with Nicole when it was happening, as I'm sure I could have helped you even more, through all I've learned myself about "alternative" methods of healing. The even sadder and frustrating part for me about this is that you were a mere 3 hrs. from me when you were in Ed., as I'm close to Calg. and I'd just 2 years previously given my fur-daughter's primary care over to a distance homeopathic vet....probably the most renowned one in the whole U.S., in addition to her local integrative vet. in Calg. I wish so much that I could have passed that info. off to you, when you needed it most, as homeopathy would have stood a very good chance of alleviating the mental state your poor Nicole was left in from those drugs. My heart just breaks about that.

However, all the proactive measures you DID take were definite blessings, for Nicole, and for yourself, and I hope that brings you a bit of solace now. We all learn the hard way what harms and what helps, terribly unfortunately. For me, I got my biggest wake-up call when my kidlets (esp. my darling girl) reacted severely to their last vaccination combo. shot.....and so my own methods changed dramatically from that time on (and zero vaccines ever again!). I know it's so awfully hard to come to terms with everything we've done previously that didn't serve our babies well, but I now consider such things to be turning points for the soul's growth (ours and theirs), and as such, blessings that, like our babies, will never die.

Your visualizations, to my mind, are yet another means of carrying on your continuing relationship with Nicole, and transmuting pain into more peace, and I commend you for the wisdom you've shown in doing just that. Since my own growth is ever-evolving, from what I've since learned about quantum physics and how that relates to spirituality & the REAL reality of things, I'd even venture to say that the inherent power in your visualizations HAVE and DO affect Nicole's continuing existence on another plane....yet still so close to yours. I hope you can take comfort from knowing, then, that you're still helping to create a loving "ripple effect" for your fur-girl, as well as for yourself.

It gladdens my heart to know that although you had to wait over 5 years for a sign from Sasha, you still got one! If that further helps you to have patience for one (or many) from Nicole, all the better, as many of us here know what a horrible frustration that can be, waiting and waiting, while our faith takes a beating.

But you asked for some of our own signs. I've had many, from both of my kidlets, although the more tangible ones were from my girl, Nissa's, brother, Sabin. Among many others, Nissa and I heard him clawing in our closet one night, a closet he'd liked to snooze in at times, in their carrier. We also used to hear him jumping down from some of his favourite perches upstairs and Nissa and I would be straining, all goosey-necked, both swearing we'd be seeing him loping down the stairs to join us on the couch....and then we'd both be crushed, of course, when he didn't appear like magic. Plus, one morning just as I was waking up (so awake, but eyes still closed) I distinctly felt/heard him stick his snoot in my ear and purr, as he tromped my hair, my absolute all-time favourite lovey thing he'd always done. My very first thought was nothing, really, as for a split second it was as if nothing was abnormal and he hadn't left. When in the next split second I realized the awful truth, I then thought it was Nissa, and perhaps he was coming through her for my sake, which he also did later on but in different ways, several times. So I opened my eyes. Naturally (groan), the feeling and sound stopped and when I looked around, I saw that Nissa was still sleeping way down on my legs....so it definitely hadn't been HER. And then I realized.....my boy had popped in to reassure me "all is well, Mom, and I'm still alive." Those were the most powerful signs I got from him, although there were certainly many others to follow.

As for my fur-daughter, when she transitioned, this time it was my husband who heard her clawing outside his bathroom door shortly after she'd left. He'd thought it was me, trying to help him feel more 'normal,' as Nissa's chosen routine was to always have a play with her Daddy before bedtime and she'd often have to wait outside the door until he'd washed up. I, sadly, never got to hear this one and haven't had any tactile messages from her at all. However, I've gotten so many other signs from her, I can't even count them all by now - 2.5 years later. But hers are of the more subtle variety, to match her personality, which was very soft and gentle in everything she did. So she's sent me songs at just the right times, rainbows (from both of them, actually) at just the right times, cloud formations of her both through another member on this board AND one of her with an angel wing that I saw myself, auditory signs of her jumping down from her warm fridge cupboard, her special numbers ALL the time (same as Sabin still does), pictures of grey cats who look so much like her just when I need them, one very brief but powerful dream visitation (and a few subtler ones), and so many more. She's just always near me, even as my heart is still weeping from missing her so much, and I know she's being true to her 'word' (through an ACer) that she'll NEVER leave me, ever.

I've written about my signs here in some of my own threads, and in fact, I've just received 3 more in the last week that I still have to enter in the journal I keep on these. One of these involved a friend of mine in the U.S. who not only saw Sabin's name 3x in a short period of time, but just wrote me to say it hadn't even dawned on her beforehand (she's grieving her own cat's 'loss' right now, so is pretty fuzzy-headed yet) but she's just seen Nissa's name twice in the last week at her workplace, too! Since she works with lots of people's names all the time and she's never seen either ONE of theirs until now......oh yes, they're definitely signs!

So those are some of mine, and you'd think I'd be content with so many.........but NO ......I'm still fretting that I haven't had the TYPE I want from my girl -- that more tangible, tactile and even, if you please, verifiable-by-witness kind! We grieving animal parents can be an ornery lot that way. But then, I'm sure any one of us would give our very arm or leg to just be able to fully experience the wholly-normal touch, scent &/or sight of our babies once more.....and then that "once more" wouldn't be enough, either. And so we wait......until that glorious "one day........."

P.S. If you haven't already, I'd highly recommend you read Kim Sheridan's "Animals and the Afterlife" and even "Hello from Heaven" by Bill & Judy Guggenheim (the latter dealing with human ADCs but still very affirming).

P.P.S. There is also another member here who lives on The Island in BC -- Zita & Ziggy's Mom, Jan -- maybe you live not far apart from each other?

Thank you for your kind reply to me, Judy. No, unfortunately I didn't take a picture of Sasha's image in the snow. It never even occurred to me at the time. I was a mess, in the darkest despair I've ever experienced and actually wanted to die with Nicole all the while Sasha's loyal image was present.
There were other opportunities I missed too. It wasn't til I came here nearly 3 months after Nicole died where I read of others who had a clipping of their baby's hair. I thought, oh god, why didn't I cut off a lock of her hair so I could touch something that was actually part of her body. I had a few strands in her hairbrush that I gathered but they don't have the same feel as the touch of her coat. And then others here who had a footprint of their baby. And I thought if only I'd have of thought of that while Nicole was alive or even taken a print of her precious little foot before I buried her.

Nicole was 14 years 7 months old when she died. Sasha died 12 days before her 20th birthday. In their case reincarnation wasn't possible between them as Sasha was still alive for 9 years after Nicole was born. And she let Nicole know in those 9 years that she (Sasha) was mommy's big girl.

Again, thank you so much for writing to me, Judy. You're always so supportive and thoughtful to everyone who is grieving on here, even while your own grief for your babies is so keenly felt. Thank you. Lynda

Thank you for your response to me Furkidlet's Mom. I have had a similar experience with vaccinations. I used to take my babies every yr for a check up and vacc. One yearly visit, shortly after their shots, all 3 of my then babies (Sasha, Micalen, and Leonard) started scratching. Because it was all of them I suspected something contagious. They went through all kinds of tests and treatments for the usual suspects- mites, fleas, ringworm, etc but the vet could find no cause. Then the itching stopped on its own. It wasn't til a few yrs later with my Nicole's hell and finally the holistic vet that I heard of the connection with vaccinations and all sorts of side effects and I recalled this unexplained itching. It hadn't occurred to my vet at the time that there could be a correlation.

Thank you for sharing your signs. I was especially touched by the way you describe Nissa. "But hers are of the more subtle variety, to match her personality, which was very soft and gentle in everything she did." That was so beautifully put it made me sigh with the tenderness and depth of feeling for her. It just occurred to me, was it you who'd written of looking for the day's calendar for a shelter, I believe, and the picture of the day was of a cat that looked like your baby, even the way she held herself? I remember reading that somewhere here and I looked at the day's picture she was referring to and I was stunned by the resemblance. I thought, Wow, and my skin was tingling it was so strikingly similar. Like the snow form of Sasha.

Zita and Ziggy's mom, Jan..I don't know everybody by name here on Mudge. It seems to me I've heard of someone named Jan but I'd have to check with some of the social butterflies to see if they know of her. There's about 100 people (depending on who you ask) who live here full time and more summer residents.

Yeah, we grieving parents are an ornery lot, ain't we just! Well said, and thank you so much Furkidlet's Mom. Lynda

Joanne, what can I say? My heart went out to you right from the start when I started reading Rassy and Howards' thread beginning when your Rassy cat was still alive (though by the time I was reading it much time had passed). I read through all the posts, feeling for you with each hope and each disappointment you went through. You just don't know how much comfort I took reading your posts. I chuckled at your choice names for the vet who refused Rassy an enema-killer vet, monster vet. I was with you, but it took me a couple weeks to write my thoughts.

I just want to share a little something with you, I always take out the crossword puzzles from our local free paper to do later. And I usually grab a few (--hmm-a handful sometimes--) extra copies of the paper to light my woodstove. Shortly after I began reading your posts I decided it was time to remove the crossword puzzle pages from the papers that had been sitting for a couple months. On the same page as the crossword is a picture of a tuxedo cat name Baracuda who was the pet of the week for the SPCA. As your family of tuxedoes grew, so did my copies of Baracuda with the crossword puzzle. He's a nice looking boy, but not as good looking as Rassy. Rassy has a presence that , I don't know, just that special something, a kind of quiet confidence.

I'll look for that book you recommend, "animals and the afterlife". Furkidlet's Mom suggested it , too. Grateful to both of you for telling me about it.

Thank you, I'm glad I made it here. Took me awhile. Pretty much toughed out the most painful agony alone with Tsuki, my darling little 2yr old furbaby. I don't think I'd have made it without her. I've never felt so struck by grief and, like you, I've loved and lost other babies that I loved with all my heart. Lightning strikes was the most appropriate name for the way this particular grief for Nicole hit me.

Great big hug to you, Joanne.

With fondnesss, Lynda

Thanks for the hug, Joanne. I could feel it from here!

When you expressed your pain or anger at Rassy cat's experience, I hurt for you. I had gone through the same emotions and it helped me to read your words because you shoot straight from the hip, so honest about how you felt. For me, especially the first 2 months after Nicole died, she was all I could or wanted to think about. When I wasn't crying, I was beating myself up for all the missed opportunities I had to show her just how much I loved her and I agonized over the times I was harsh or insensitive with her, or I was raging at the grave injustice Nicole had to endure in this world.

This was one time in my life that I was actually glad that I wasn't in a relationship with a man. I could cry, swear, play the same song over and over again that I shared with Nicole, scream out my pain without having someone tell me it was time to stop grieving and move on with my life. And because I live on a half acre, I could cry or swear as loud as I wanted. And because all my thoughts were focussed on Nicole, it would have put a strain on a human relationship. Yes, the human support would be so welcomed but unless the other felt the same intensity of anguish, I would have felt stifled to grieve as I needed to. I thought, now I know why some marriages break up with the death of a child.

Little Tsuki needed me and I let her know that I loved her just as dearly as I ever did, but that right now Mommy was so heartbroken over Nicole. And she let me know in everything she did that she understood. She batted at my feet, jumped up to my chest, licked my face (little tongue like sandpaper), nipped my chin, and did all the other little things she has always done with me. She was my light in an intense dark, heavy time. I'm glad I'd already established a relationship with her before Nicole died. She saved my life. And you're right, Joanne, animals do teach us unconditional love.

Oh, NO! You have a blod clot on your arm. I remember you discussing your surgery on your thumb. I wish you all the best. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow. Please let us know how your doctor's visit went.

Warmly, Lynda

Furkidlets' Mom

It hit me this morning- I knew those names (Zita and Ziggy)sounded familiar. Yes I know Jan! I call her by her full name and it didn't register with me she was the one you were referring to. I did the same when I first moved here and someone asked me if I was going to Barb's party. I said, no, I didn't know her. Then it dawned on me they were talking about Barbara, the name I used to call her. Duh!
Yes, Jan is a very quiet, gentle, thoughtful woman. She shared her Christmas dinner with me and some other island residents. I didn't know she was a member here. I'll talk with her about it when I see her again. Thanks for telling me.

PS I love your chosen names for your babies, Nissa and Sabin.

Hi Lynda,

Again, a big "WOW" from me! In reverse order to your replies.....that is SO cool that you actually already KNOW Jan!! HA!! I had no idea you two lived that close to each other - I knew she lived at Mt. somethingerother (the name escapes me now), but I'm not all that familiar with all the Island places, just the usual, main ones. In fact, I just 'met' (online) another woman who also trained in the same healing modality as I did, who now lives in Tofino (used to be in Calg, and apparently misses IT more than where she is NOW! ...don't think that would be ME!). The time-space concept is only as 'far apart' as you want it to be.... I haven't heard back from Jan in a couple of wks, so if you see or talk to her, please say "Hi. Hope you're doing better!" from me!

Yes, just like your babies (but with other, even worse conditions added, too), Nissa also began scratching in EARNEST after their last-ever shots....the difference being since I then found an integrative/holistic vet here, we knew soon enough the REAL cause of it, so began working with homeopathic remedies to try and ammeliorate or cure the vaccinosis in both of them. We never did get quite all of it healed, though, even though we had great success with some other conditions they each had, and certainly had improvements in many of their vaccinosis symptoms. And that showed me just how harmful those things could be to animals. So unfortunately, sometimes the effects from vaccines are either permanent or almost so. And that's why I've tried so hard to spread the word BEFORE other animals are likewise harmed, perhaps for good.

However, I'd also had some discussions with our fabulous distance vet. about brain conditions, even those kinds that linger after anesthesia, which is much more common than most people realize. Allopathy has no recourse for such things. And so I also learned how very effective homeo. remedies can be to help the body 'shake off' such damage. So when Nissa had to have her dental surgery, I also had on hand 2 remedies to address this, just in case. But because we'd also begun homeo. trtmnt. BEFORE surgery (as well as all the other energetic aids I added pre, during and post surgery), thankfully she never suffered any of those effects. Plus, her dental vet. was also absolutely fabulous and worked with me SO helpfully, too, esp. with things such as the particular anesthetic she chose. Since Nissa was 'under' for quite awhile, and was also already 16 then, I made sure to look at every, single aspect that we could effect a measure of control over....and boy, did THAT pay off in spades for us! No complications, rapid, rapid healing, and a healthier, happier gal to show for it! Therefore, I also learned the valuable lesson of not stopping asking as MANY QUESTIONS AS POSSIBLE, prior to any invasive procedure....even a simple needle is "invasive" to the body, so....one needs to be as prepared & knowledgeable as possible because most regular vets. don't offer enough info. UNLESS YOU ASK. And even then, they certainly don't know &/or promote safer, more natural aids, that's for sure. There's hopeful news about this changing, though, which I intend to post about separately here. If all goes well, this will create a TIDAL WAVE of support for so-called "alternative" therapies in the western world.

My poor boy, Sabin, ended up physically dying from cancerous conditions (I don't consider "cancer" a lone diseases -- in fact, most conditions AREN'T technically "diseases" but dis-eases -- but more like an accu mulation of many things out of whack in the body, just as holistic physicians do) when he (and his sister) was 13, though. Through the course of their ailments, I learned more about how not only deadly mercury but ALSO cancerous agents and 'viruses' are actually introduced INTO vaccines, on purpose.... It's a hell of a world, this whole system of allopathic 'medicine' is! If EVERYONE knew the true extent of it, they'd be horrified, as they rightly SHOULD be, frankly. And one can no longer even call it "MEDICINE," once you know what is entailed. Instead of realizing how empowering it is for all concerned to learn about what's really gone on and still goes on, most people don't WANT to know, thinking it will instead just make them feel things they don't want to feel.....like guilt & fear. But they don't realize, either, that once you take responsibility into your OWN hands, you end up feeling less powerless to effect the changes you want to see. It's just sad and is another reason I work so hard at re-educating others into their own power.

You asked, Yes! That was indeed me. And thanks for remembering that particular story of mine about my girl! In like fashion, on a day this week when I was feeling absolutely terrible about my life, she did it again......3 times!! On my daily cat calendar, first there was ANOTHER picture of a grey cat, who, honest-to-God, looked EXACTLY like her, even down to her cushy-plushy yet sleek cheeks (hard to find this exact combo. in most cats I've seen), with the only difference being the eye colour - more green, like Sabin's used to be when he was young and before he got sicker after those stupid vaccines. THEN, I'd clicked on the Animal Rescue Site that day, to see ANOTHER grey cat who looked similar. And THEN, the next day, when I first clicked on the ARS (hey, that's not a very nice acronym! ) it had changed, as it does each day, to a pic & story of a dog....yet when I later went back to click again that same day, THERE WAS THE GREY CAT AGAIN, instead! I've NEVER seen the day's pic go back to the PREVIOUS day's yet, in the 2 or so yrs. I've been clicking there. WOW......{{{{{my girl}}}}}. She astounds me in her supreme creativity to get my attention! I also just had, in the last 2 days, her send me for the 3rd and 4th times, her particular #s on our humidistat/temp. gauge, those being "23" (the day she 'left') and "19" (her age in yrs. when she 'left'), both showing at the same time and catching my eye as I walked down the hall. It is because of the recurrance (they say the signs that repeat themselves are even MORE indicative that they're signs) of her many ways of getting through to me (same as Sabin's) that no one can ever convince me that our babies, and anyone we've ever loved, AREN'T still with us, each and every day, and most especially when we need their ongoing support the most.

So yes, even though her signs are of the more "subtle" variety, they're equally just as persistent, determined and insistent as she ALSO always was!!! And how I LOOOOVE HER for still being herself! This song really speaks to me about Nissa and her ever-loving signs to me. You're Still You - Josh Groban

And you know, I LOVE your own recognition of the inner power, self-acceptance and actual benefits of being single during your grief over Nicole. That recognition is a HUGE blessing on and for yourself....SO lovely a thing to see in someone. You ROCK, girl, just for that! You're so right about this. I've had so many people around me (at the time) NOT be anywhere near "the same intensity of anguish", including my own H, that they ended up causing me even worse and longer pain because of it. That kind of thing, as I've learned through all 4 of my largest losses (the ones of my babies the worst, natch), only brings you what's known as "complicated grief"....something none of us ever needs, as it's bad enough on its own, thanks!

Also, more thanks to you for loving my kidlets' names. It also brings up another story related to animal communication, and why I know it's a fact. One of my favourite ACers, on her very first 'read' with my boy, verified this for me so succinctly it wasn't funny. I'd asked if he could give me a clear validation that it was really HIM we were talking to - the very first question on my list. Irene came back saying, "He says he's the loyal one....that I'm talking to the loyal one. Irene had no clue either what he was referring to, nor was she even sure she was getting this message exactly straight, as it sounded a bit confusing to her. Naturally, I burst into tears.....because that not only was the MEANING of his name, but more importantly, was a large part of the reason I'd CHOSEN that name for him in the first place! And throughout his life, I'd always told him that he did, indeed, hold that attribute carried by his given name....even though I didn't as often call him that in comparison to his many nicknames. And of course, NOW I know that even after his physical death, he's still true to his name, through all the signs he's sent me since, and still continues to send to this very day.

Man.....every time I sit and think, or am reminded such as now, about how powerfully my beloved kidlets love me, their Mom, and still take care of me, I'm blown right away. Along with the attendant tears, also flows that boundless love. I'm so PROUD of my gal and my guy, I could burst. And I can't even imagine what or who I might have turned into without them.

I also know exactly what you mean by saying and recognizing that your little Tsuki (also a really sweet name!) saved your life. Nissa got me through ALL my other losses and some terrible, terrible times, and my heart simply bursts with grati tude for all she did for me (and Sabin, too, before, in his own equally as powerful ways) for almost 20 years. And while that's what makes her own transition so much harder to bear, with no HER left to get me through her own passing (that always makes my head just spin).....and yet I have to also acknowledge that she still IS trying as hard as she can to get me to transmute my sorrow over her 'loss.' What greater love IS there than this? (there's no "emoticon" that does justice to the expression on my face as I feel everything I feel about this)

You've done so many things 'right' in your mourning and I just need to let you know how proud of & grateful for you I am. Please keep sharing, whatever you need or want to share, as this helps me, too, even after as long as it's been for me already. And may all your fur angels and whatever other kinds you're linked with surround you and keep supporting you, just as we do here, and even then some!

Many hugs and blessings,
Nissakinski's and Boobly's Mom (they each had millions of nicknames, so I can change it up as often as I like here!)

Furkidlets' Mom and Joanne
Both of your posts meant so much to me. I wanted to respond to you right away, but as usual with me, it's getting late and I'm worn out and having a hard time to construct a decent sentence let alone give the kind of consideration I want to give to you. You guys have really changed so much of how I've been dealing with Nicole's death. I thought of that off and on all day today. So i think I'll just hit the bed and get in touch tomorrow. thanks for all you've done for me.
Lynda

Furkidlets' Mom

Thank you for letting me know that it was you who'd written about the Rescue picture of the day. You know, I thought about that the day after I wrote to you, and recalled that what touched me most about it was that she had given you that on Mother's Day. She was the one who remembered you on that special day. What a lovely thing to do for you!

I really like what you said "I'm so PROUD of my guy and my gal, I could burst. I can't even imagine what or who I would have turned into without them." It's so nice to hear someone acknowledge how proud she is of her furkids. But I've never before thought about how my babies have been instrumental in developing who I am. It's just so true! I'd never recognized that before reading your comment. What a deeply insightful perception. I'll be thinking about that as I remember each of my babies. I'm really blown away by this realization. Thank you so much for sharing that, Furkidlets' Mom.

Hugs,
Lynda

Joanne
Yeah I know what you mean about someone saying, "It's just a cat, grow up!" Thankfully no one said that to me with Nicole's death. But I kept pretty clear of people that I knew had that attitude to animals. But I did get that alot when I was just a kid when one of our furbabies died.

But I remember someone saying to me in May/94 that I shouldn't be so upset since I had other cats, after the death of Leonard (not exactly crazy about the name but he was named after a guy I used to like -oh boy!). I thought, but didn't say to him, would you say that to a mother after she lost one of her children?

I remember I was very proud of you when reading Rassy cat and Howard's thread where someone had said something like you could just get another cat (maybe this woman you're referring to). You asked them if they lost their parents, siblings or something, would they think they could just get new ones. I thought what a brilliant retort! Good for you!

In discussing the intensity of grief one feels, you said "Some seem to put things to rest so easy...but for us....not ever..." How beautifully and aptly put, Joanne.

I hope you're able to have some rest as your trusted doctor told you to. I don't get migraine headaches but when I'm sleep deprived I get pounding headaches for about 4 days. I'd rather almost anything than a headache. You know, Joanne, you're a really remarkable woman. You've geen grieving, caring for babies with all kinds of special needs, have your own health issues, comfort me and others, and you do it all so generously. Hugs. Lynda

Furkidlets' Mom
OOPS! I may have jumped the gun. You said that Jan was from Mt. something. No, the lady I know is from Mudge Island. She had a cat and dog, who both died before I moved here. She showed me a picture of them, and those names Zita and Ziggy sound familiar. I thought it just had to be her when you said she came from The Island but I may be mistaken. I should've checked first. I still haven't talked with her, but I'll ask her when I see her. And I'll let you know.
Lynda

Lynda,

The Jan I'm referring to is on Vancouver Is. This is one of her threads - here, that will give you at least part of her story. That's not her most recent thread, though, as she's also had even more loss since then - Rosie, her ex's dog, as well as the loss of her marriage. I'm sure you can find her other, more recent threads from there. It would be quite the 'coincidence,' though, if BOTH these "Jans" were connected to a Zita & a Ziggy!

Hi Nicoles Mom, I'm so sorry to hear of your baby's passing. Like Judy said, she was next to you when her time came which is where she wanted to be. I too, am not so sure what happens "afterwards". I just hope it is everything everyone believes it is and more. How could we ever get past our grief if there is nothing to hold onto and look forward to seeing our pets again.
You asked about signs. I believe you got a hugh one. It's fantastic. A sign from my Arthur is what brought me here. Long story short, when I took his ashes home I begged for him to give me a sign I did the right thing in letting him go. The next a.m. a cat with similar features to him was in my yard. Never saw it around before and haven't seen it since. If you find my original post The Furry Love of my Life I Know He Hears Me, you can read the whole thing and there's pictures of Arthur and the "sign cat".
Those "coincidences" or signs as we like to call them is what we need to believe that we will see our baby's again. I hope being here at LS will bring you peace and comfort..Hugs.. Ann

Hi Furkidlets' Mom
Thanks for the clarification. And sorry for any confusion I caused. My mistake. No, they're not the same person. But when I talk to Janice, I'll ask her what her babies' names were again. It would be a very cool coincidence if they were the same as your friend Jan's.
Thanks for all your insightful posts.
Lynda

Hi Joanne

Gee, I don't understand how someone who'd had a dog companion herself for 19 years and knowing her own pain at his/her death could be so insensitive to your loss. And especially when she's a friend of yours. Ouch! But I know, a once close family member of mine told me one time that she thought I was a bit strange for loving my animals so intensely. At another time when I told her that my animals were sons and daughters to me, I got the dead silence on the other end of the phone line. I could almost see the patronizing, "oh brother" look in her eyes that I'd seen too often. I have no human children, my animals are my children. They are like flesh from my flesh, bone from my bone to me.

You make an excellent point about people being impressed with bonding between different species but not when it comes to the bond between other species and humans. That's so true. Too often humans are seen as special and set apart from other animals and nature.

The beauty of LS is that it's a place where we can grieve, let out the pain. If someone sees your posts as rehashing, no one's twisting his/her arm to read it. For others, it brings comfort. I find we all seem to get stuck on some point of pain that needs to be expressed and expressed because it's important to us and it's just so d*** painful.

And yeah, the old "you're spending all that money on an ANIMAL! There's starving children in Africa!" Yeah, well you see a need in Africa, don't let me stop you from carrying out your mission. I'm busy here with my own! And i don't exactly see you contributing to my cause.
And the old"You're so self-absorbed". If you were caring for or grieving a human, you may be considered a compassionate person. So why the 'self-absorbed' accusation when it's an animal you're grieving. Double standard.

Thank you for being there for me, Joanne. Glad I've come here.
Hugs, Lynda

Hi Ann

Thanks for your kind words. Yeah I appreciate what both you and Judy said about Nicole being where she wanted to be, next to me when she died. What's painful to me is that I wanted to be with her, really with her, as she was dying. I promised her I would be. And I wasn't. In my own experiences, I've felt as alone in a bed with someone asleep as if they weren't there.

And what rubs salt into the wound is that I'm a night owl and have trouble sleeping most nights. But not on the only night that it mattered most to me and to Nicole. Nights before and after Nicole died, I was in my usual pattern of laying awake hour after hour, sleeping, then waking. I felt my baby was gypped of my comfort when she needed it most. I'm coming to terms with it now, I have no choice, but it'll always be an anguish that I carry within myself.

Yes Ann, I do remember reading about that cat so similar to Arthur coming only once into your yard. And what was so striking about that was that you were going to go in a different direction (I can't recall what you were going to do) but for some unexplained reason you went to a different side of the house or something. And in that place there was a cat so like Arthur. I was very stirred by your experience. Thank you so much for sharing it. I was deeply comforted by it.

Thanks again for taking the time to post to me. I love the name you've given to Arthur "The Furry Love of My Life I know He Hears Me". Beautiful! I think I'll re-read your thread.

Hugs. Lynda

Lynda,

Yes, I think most of us have suffered the "slings and arrows" of insensitive, biased, human-centred, animal loss minimizing nonsense at one time or another. I've had 'friends' (now former), relatives (now cut off) and acquaintances (dumped), all give me extra grief. One boldly said my grief (over my girl) was "just crazy!"; my Mother (when still alive herself) spat out that "NO ONE grieves like that over a CAT!" (over my boy); one completely ignored & talked over the news that my girl had died and didn't even give me a forced "Oh, I'm sorry to hear that"; one did say a quick "Oh, that's too bad," but then went on to complain about all HER own mundane troubles; one closer couple ignored us at our 1st sorrowful Christmas - not even one, lousy phone call around that Day to see how we were coping; one sent me an email FWD of a story about how a little girl was SAVED FROM DEATH at Christmastime (again, just before this "first" for us)....and on and on....one after another, they'd poured salt into my wounds. I gave them all up, except for my Mother (who was 'forced' into showing me more respect about that after that incident).

But here's the other sad part about this nonsense -- I got much the same kind of heartless commentary and lack of empathy even for the deaths of my Mother and brother! One was SHOCKED that a mere 3 months after my Mother's death, I was STILL grieving -- I just about hit the roof. Another said it was "rather self-indulgent" to be grieving her at ALL, because she'd been 84 when she died.....and again, on and on. So this crap wasn't even limited to the loss of my furkids. Talk about getting even MORE rapidly soured on the human race as a whole. Is it any wonder our world is so screwed up, with folks like THIS running around doing such added damage?

What made it even worse at the time was others telling me I "should" be the understanding one and realize these people just didn't understand. Now, I'll admit that's the basic truth, but when someone's in shock at the insensitivity and callousness heaped upon you during the freshest parts of your grief, it's too hard, too far to make such a large and instantaneous LEAP from the extreme pain all the way to "Oh, okay, I forgive you your ignorance." That takes quite a bit longer a time span to reach. (and of course doesn't mean one has to keep such people in one's life, regardless) At the time, ALL I wanted was to scream and shout and rage against such injustice and cold-heartedness, as this was supposed to be MY time to be understood, if never before! Even now, it's a bit difficult to stay feeling neutral when I recall these particular barbs, even if I CAN understand at the same time that these folks are just not enlightened enough. And it also hurt even more each time I read or heard about someone else's experience where they received so much comfort and understanding from THEIR circle of friends and family, who were obviously much nicer people than mine!

I didn't expect them to fully or even partially understand that, just like you (and many others here), what was important was that I felt my furkids were my children. I even asked some of these people to try and 'get' that regardless of how THEY perceived it, it was MY very real pain that was what I wanted them to respond to, their own opinions aside. Didn't help. They refused, period. So THEN my reaction was that I felt UNLOVABLE, never mind unloved. It was as if they were saying they couldn't and wouldn't respect my feelings (or therefore, me), whether they could relate or not. I wasn't worth, in their eyes, an opening of their own hearts to at least my PAIN, understandable or not. So now I've come to the point where I KNOW there are enough people who feel the same way (whether they talk about it much or not), that I really feel the ones who DON'T 'get' these bonds are the weird ones!

You (and Joanne) said, "Too often humans are seen as special and set apart from other animals and nature." Yes, that's the crux of the matter, isn't it? It's also why our earth is in the dire straits it's in right now, an unprecedented state that now threatens all creatures' very existence upon the planet. It's clear as a bell, yet people won't own up to it.

And oh yes, that tired and worn argument about why aren't you INSTEAD helping HUMAN children on the planet?! I LOVED your last rejoinder about "And i don't exactly see you contributing to my cause." EXACTLY. WE'RE expected to give to ALL the causes, but they're not! Pips. One famous animal activist (but I forget which man it was right now) has said in response to that garbage, that he's "working at the ROOTS" by helping animals, and that's exactly IT.

"And the old"You're so self-absorbed". If you were caring for or grieving a human, you may be considered a compassionate person. So why the 'self-absorbed' accusation when it's an animal you're grieving. Double standard." Exactly, again. I've railed about this over and over. The very attributes that are lauded and heaped with praise when applied to HUMAN dilemmas and causes (or even between animal species), are scorned and maligned when applied to anything between animals and humans. It's just plain disgusting and hypocritical. WHEN ARE PEOPLE GOING TO FULLY WAKE UP?

I can understand your frustration and regret about not being with Nicole THE WHOLE TIME during her dying process, and I've suffered the same myself, over my boy...it still hurts to even think about it. But I try to remind myself that I couldn't HELP fall asleep, I was SO exhausted that last night he was here. It really wasn't my fault and I didn't INTEND to, and if the shoe were on the other paw and HE'd fallen asleep and gotten more rest and was then more able & capable of being with me for my final moments here, I certainly wouldn't fault HIM for that. I'd be glad that he'd gotten more rest! That would be another form of us applying that unconditional love and acceptance of each other TO each other. And I kept this in mind, too, for when Nissa was dying, soon to be euthanized. Again, I was exhausted from so many months (oh heck, YEARS, really!) of worry, care giving that only increased as time wore on, the strain of anticipatory grieving, etc., and decided perhaps the rightest thing would be to go to sleep with her AS IF everything were normal, perhaps helping HER to feel more normal because of it. Plus, I'd be more alert the next day, for HER sake as much as mine -- once more, as equal partners in our lifetime love affair.

So things happen, often out of our control. And even when under our control, it's an act of love, benefiting the Whole in the 'end', to also take care of and show ourselves self-love. And in your case, it's not like you INTENDED to sleep any differently than usual -- it just happened that way. But I know why you just WANT it to be different, all logic or other arguments aside. We want to do everything perfectly for our furbabies, even IF we're not capable of achieving that perfection. We just believe they deserve it to be that way....and they do, but sometimes things just don't manifest that way for them and us. And then we have to learn how NOT to beat ourselves up because of it....at least, not in the long run.

I'm so sorry, though....I know how much it....just....hurts.

Hi Furkidlets' Mom
I just cracked right up when I read your words: "I've had friends (now former), relatives (now cut off) and acquaintances (dumped). Beauty! LOL Not that I'm glad you had those experiences, but it feels good to know I'm not alone. I've had the exact same response from family members, who in my case feigned (though they thought they were quite convincing) sympathy for Nicole and me and couldn't wait to change the subject to 'what was realy important and interesting'. But god that had to hurt when the couple, knowing of your sorrow, sent you nothing but a FWD about a little girl being saved in the same season as your baby lost hers. I'm sorry to hear that. Joanne, too, has had more than her share of people trivializing not only her feelings, but the value of her animal companions.

You're right, me too-it only really matters to me that I recognize the great dignity of my sons and daughters. Truly.

Would that animal activist you're referring to be Mark Hawthorne and his book 'Striking at the Roots"?

Thanks for saying that I would forgive Nicole if her and I were to change places. And yes, I would, in a heartbeat. In fact there'd be nothing to forgive, I'd know it was unintentional. And you're right my sleeping was unintentional, too. What I bitterly resent is that my d*** insomnia didn't kick in and make itself useful on the only night I could'a used its company! It's been such a faithful companion since I was 8 years old. You'd think it could make its usual visit on this night of nights. Joking aside, it's not guilt I feel but a singular anguish from my baby. Your last sentence in that paragraph struck the very chord I experienced: " PLUS, I'd be more alert the next day, for HER sake as much as mine--once once, as equal partners in our lifetime love affair." Beautifully said and true for Nicole and me, too. Kisses to Nissa from us. And I'm sorry for your loss of her, Furkidlets' Mom.

Hi Joanne

I really like the question you asked your family member: Is it really wrong to love another species as deeply as we are supposedly taught to love our own? I admire you for having the courage to confront him/her with that very profound question. Most of my family claim to and do have affection for SOME non-humans. My mother was my first model for loving cats and dogs. But even at that, they had their place to her, and it wasn't equal to humans. I've always had a strong affinity for animals and didn't see a boundary separating them from humans. And that perspective has stayed with me and deepened all my life. I have to be honest, I can no longer bear to be in the company of anyone who has the slightest disrepect for animals.

And, oh yeah, the whole "animals have no souls". Yeah, that gem. I grew up a Catholic and was taught that animals had no soul. I was belittled for loving animals. But mostly I was shamed and made to feel guilty for loving them so deeply. It's an important part of the reason I left the church. Unfortunately I'm still intimidated to speak as strongly and directly as you do in the defense of animals and my love for them. Maybe time in your company, and that of Furkidlets' Mom, Jorge,and some of the other members here, I can feel more empowered to give them a stronger voice too. The concept of a soul is a human construct - (from the Gk-psyche, Latin-anima)-that which animates, breath-which ALL life has. The church molded it into something only humans had- how nice of them! So, yeah, Joanne, to answer your question, either we all (non-human and human) have a soul or none of us do.

You're right-people do like to project their expectations onto others. Peope try to guide me into the 'right and sensible way of thinking about animals' too, and how I should be spending my time and money. And like you said, they'd be quick to take offence if i turned the tables on them. We're each individuals, with our own set of values and priorities. Good on you, as the Aussies would say, Joanne. You just keep on keepin' on, my friend.

Thanks for the link, Joanne! You know what I like about you is that you've always said in your posts how smart animals are, and that we homo sapiens who think we're the only ones who are, could learn alot from other species. I've always thought that too. If we really listen to them, especially the ones we share our homes with because they're so close to us, we'd be really amazed at what they teach us. As you've always pointed out, they not only understand but live unconditional love and can show us the way. And forgiveness, I'm still nursing grudges from times in my past. My babies are free. They know how to let go and they have a lot more to forgive than I do. Furkidlets' Mom, too, said something I really like about how they help make us who we are. I hadn't thought about that before she said it.

I always call my companions my babies and have been very protective of them. One day, my little guy, Micalen (who has since died), looked at me after one of my doting sessions as if to say, "Mom, I'm an adult too!" It was just something that passed between us. I told him I was sorry for not recognizing that. It really changed the way I related to him. But he'll always be my baby boy, too.

Exactly, you bet we're all animals. And I'm proud of it! I like your points about the differences between non-human and human animals. Like someone pointed out to me once, we humans think we're so intelligent, but in order to do a job that requires team work, we have to have conferences, phone calls, messaging, etc, etc. And we still get it wrong a lot of the time. When lionesses want to hunt down a gazelle, without a word, each takes her place to trap and kill the unfortunate animal. And they seldom miss. We could use a little humility, to be sure! Lesser animals, indeed! LOL

Thanks for your warmth and friendship, Joanne. It's pulled me through a lot of pain, knowing i could share with you. Kisses to Rassy cat, Howard, mew and all your other furkids. And take care of your body there, like yo docta tell yu! Lynda

You might like this one, Lynda....click here.

Thank you so much, Furkidlets' Mom. I listened to the song you sent me while I looked at Nicole's picture on the Tribute page. So many words in it (The little things that seemed so small are now like gold...and I cherish every one) moved me to tears. You've come much farther than me, I took so much for granted. Bless you, Nissa, and Sabin.

I was thinking about what you said about having trouble sleeping except on the night Nicole passed. Did you ever think that maybe she didn't want you to be awake? That was the first thing that came to my mind. I remember hearing years ago, cats have a tendency to not want to be near us when it is their time. A cat pride thing I guess. I honestly believe that's what she did to not upset you..Just a thought..and I'm glad you like my story. Now that the shock wore off, that is a gift he gave me that day and one I'll always treasure. Just wish I could get past the fact that I did the right thing still, even though he told me I did...Hugs.. Ann

I did think that, Ann. (That Nicole may not have wanted me to be awake.) In fact, I said to her, the only way I can be at peace is if you didn't want me to be with you when you died. You are my child and I honor your choice. But if you wanted me awake with you through your dying, the pain of not being with you is intolerable. (I'm all busted up even now as I write this, I loved her so much. Oh to turn back the hands of time knowing what I do now.)
Yes, I loved your story about Arthur and his sign cat. That was amazing that he only appeared once, and only on that day, and his rolling contentedly on his back. It actually adds credence to your seeing him as a sign of reassurance from Arthur. But the shooting star postcard, too, felt very powerful to me. Thank you for sharing Arthur's story. Hugs..Lynda

Hi Lynda, I know your pain all too well. I put myself in your position, what if I were awake and watched her knowing there was nothing I could do. It is a battle of head and heart for sure. Frustrating. My Daisy was put down without me knowing many years ago. She was my soulmate cat. I loved her more than anything in the world, and I mean anything. 16yrs later I never recovered from it. I wanted to be with Arthur when it was time, but the pain of putting him down, being there, watching it, man, that was just as horible if not more so than not being with Daisy. There are sooo many things we wish to go back in time and change, so many things. So many things we have to move on and recover from and a lot of it is our own guilt that we feel which we shouldn't.
I still feel Nicole passed peacefully, knowing you were not going to go thru the stress of seeing her. She was next to you where she wanted to be. She did not want to see you sad. Believe in that with all your heart...Hugs..Ann

Thank you so much Ann. That means alot to me, knowing it comes from someone who has loved as you did Daisy and also Arthur. I wish you all the best in life. Your words have really touched me tonight. Hugs...Lynda