Hi all,
thanks for all the support on the loss of my beloved kitty Max. He lived a short (8 yrs) and that is what makes it hard. Did I do enough to save him? He got sick really fast and crashed hard..he was diabetic (but misdiagnosed up until a couple of weeks ago) but we couldn't regulate him and I could see him failing fast. He was getting worse by the hour. I knew I had to end his suffering and not wait until I found him dead inside the house or in a diabetic-induced coma. He lived a "larger than life" type of life...he was the best outdoor kitty. He would be in everynight w/me and has been my buddy for the last 8 years. He was here before my husband or kids! I never expected our 15+ year old cat (Sam) to outlive our other pets. Sam was my husband's cat when we got married but he is my baby too but never has or will take the place of Max. We lost our beloved lab who was barely 9 or 10 a few years ago. It is so hard...I can honestly say that I miss our dog everyday still and I miss Max terribly. I know it will get easier but the guilt kills me. I keep questioning should I have tried more options? Should I have given it more time? But, I made the best decision for him...I couldn't let him suffer any more than he already had..he had been in/out of the vet and his poor arms/legs were a pincushion. He was so badly dehydrated and lethargic, so in that respect taking him to be put down was a bit of a relief. I knew he no longer was in pain and I wasn't worried sick about him anymore. Still, no matter what losing a beloved pet is the worst. Nobody else gets it..... it was an emotional ordeal and I'm still trying to recover.
thanks again for the support, it really does make a difference! I had been on a feline diabetic website (www.yourdiabeticcat.com) to get help for Max and they were all great too, good info and lots of wonderful help/advice to get cats better. But, you know your cat the best and know when to say when. He couldn't go on the way things were (he also was believed to have pancreatic cancer)...so I know I did the right thing. Just so hard when you sign those papers to put down your animal. Yuck-
Thanks again, rest in peace to my Max and all the other beloved pets out there who I know we will see again. :)
Cheri
Full Version: Thanks For Your Support W/my Max
I don't understand this post. You mention putting him down because you did not want to come home and find him dead or in a coma whereas your previous posts said you gave him to people who could give him the care he needed. That alone would have prevented your coming home and finding him dead. I did read all your posts in here and the Sickness Section (although I just modified my answer there after reading what your final decision was), and I don't understand why you are now questioning your decision to go get him back from people who were treating him and put him down.
Only you could make such a decision and it is evident that you did what you felt you needed to do to find peace.
I am sorry Max became ill and needed the treatment you talked about. We have all been through illnesses...that's why we are here...and whatever decisions we make, we know we must always put the furbaby's needs before our own. I never had the option of treatment....I always had to have them put down because there was no treatment to improve their lives. As far as mine were concerned, I would have given anything for that option, instead of being forced to make that final decision that we all have to live with the rest of our lives.
Only you could make such a decision and it is evident that you did what you felt you needed to do to find peace.
I am sorry Max became ill and needed the treatment you talked about. We have all been through illnesses...that's why we are here...and whatever decisions we make, we know we must always put the furbaby's needs before our own. I never had the option of treatment....I always had to have them put down because there was no treatment to improve their lives. As far as mine were concerned, I would have given anything for that option, instead of being forced to make that final decision that we all have to live with the rest of our lives.
I am sorry for all that you are going through at this time, I know how much your intentions were in the right place, I know you did what you thought best and no one can judge you, no one should either.
I am also worried about you because you did not come back and I know that when we have been through so much we can be in a very fragile state.
I don't think you were thinking of yourself, I know you also talked with several vets before deciding. I think you had said they also suspected pancreatic cancer, this is often a cause of FD. Cancer interferes with insulin and without the insulin you have death by starvation. I know that professional people would have advised you on that very hard decision. This is a very difficult illness, some do make it through but the average survival is only one to two years. Usually the cats who are diabetic and survive beyond 1 or 2 years are diagnosed diabetic at a much younger age and have as such a better chance of making it, also there is less of a chance that cancer or other health problems ar at the origin of this difficult disease. There is a difference also depending on how soon the FD is diagnosed. When a cat crashes (as opposed to being diagnosed by a routine lab test) the outcome is usually worse. Regulating cats (as opposed to dogs or humans)can be very difficult. A few months ago, someone on a French diabetic forum had an eight year old cat who became diabetic, was quickly regulated but then he went into severe kidney failure and had to be pts...Kidney failure is often a result of FD and insulin treatments. Diabetes can make animals and humans more prone to all kinds of infections and their heart ,liver and kidneys are affected even with insulin. Even though some people were taking care of your cat, one day it would have had to be out of hospital, then what...can one just write an emotional blank check and hand that cat over to a complete stanger then? Not me, I would find that to be totally irresponsible and contrary to the pact I made with my cat that I would always take care of him, best as I could. Someone once wrote in a forum ''I had a diabetic cat who died about 10 years ago. If another pet of mine ever develops this disease, I will take it to the vet for euthanasia as soon as it's quality of life suffers. Unless things have greatly changed since my experience, the constant vet visits trying to stabilize the blood sugar and the many complications of diabetes are too cruel. There is no cure, only fast or slow deterioration, and I am convinced that I tortured that cat trying to prolong it's life, albeit with the best intentions in the world. I now believe that euthanasia would be a kindness".
I know that like you, I would have never accepted to abandon my cat to a hospital(what would he have thought of me then
)Was it selfishness that you could not endure the torture of allowing your own soulmate to be left there, afraid, in a cage, unable to sleep or relax through the whines and howls of the other strange suffering animals there, lame, ill, poked for glucose curves etc... I know like you I was afraid to put him through all of these things and would have been dangerously despondent from guilt, had he died in a strange place with strange people thinking I had abandonned him because he was sick.
One of my vets had a cat, only 7 years old, who got a tumor in her nose, the vet
took her 150 miles away to be treated for a month of radiation, then her cat came back and died about a month later, she herself told me that this made her feel very guilty because when she took her cat, she was still hunting in her garden, when she came back she just lay and died, as such her hunting was curtailed by medical interventions that didn't help her at all. WE have at our disposal an impressive amount of choice, the answers to these choices are ours and ours only, how dare anyone call a decision selfish when one hasn't been there to see, to evaluate, to sense and to feel. The thing is we never can know if the decision was best, but only we have the choice and chose we must, we try and chose where our heart is, that should be respected
as much as we respect others for agreeing to 'inflict' any kind of treatment on their pets. We have to respect their choices even though we ourselves could never want our animals to suffer like that.
I do think that in my case, I erred in putting him to sleep. I thought he was despondent, I thought he was so sick he didn't want to go on, during the last hour I realized he was greatly disappointed that I had chosen to end his life. I admit it was a mistake, but with the best intentions, made out of love. And I still wonder if the other options could have turned out to be just as bad if not worse. If anyone wants to berate me for my decision with Yukon, I'm fair game, I have put so much reflection into this, each minute of life has been assimilating this for the last 16 moths now, I am strong and able to put up with this at this time, but if you had done this only weeks after I put my Yukon to sleep I might not have survived this, no kidding.
I am also worried about you because you did not come back and I know that when we have been through so much we can be in a very fragile state.
I don't think you were thinking of yourself, I know you also talked with several vets before deciding. I think you had said they also suspected pancreatic cancer, this is often a cause of FD. Cancer interferes with insulin and without the insulin you have death by starvation. I know that professional people would have advised you on that very hard decision. This is a very difficult illness, some do make it through but the average survival is only one to two years. Usually the cats who are diabetic and survive beyond 1 or 2 years are diagnosed diabetic at a much younger age and have as such a better chance of making it, also there is less of a chance that cancer or other health problems ar at the origin of this difficult disease. There is a difference also depending on how soon the FD is diagnosed. When a cat crashes (as opposed to being diagnosed by a routine lab test) the outcome is usually worse. Regulating cats (as opposed to dogs or humans)can be very difficult. A few months ago, someone on a French diabetic forum had an eight year old cat who became diabetic, was quickly regulated but then he went into severe kidney failure and had to be pts...Kidney failure is often a result of FD and insulin treatments. Diabetes can make animals and humans more prone to all kinds of infections and their heart ,liver and kidneys are affected even with insulin. Even though some people were taking care of your cat, one day it would have had to be out of hospital, then what...can one just write an emotional blank check and hand that cat over to a complete stanger then? Not me, I would find that to be totally irresponsible and contrary to the pact I made with my cat that I would always take care of him, best as I could. Someone once wrote in a forum ''I had a diabetic cat who died about 10 years ago. If another pet of mine ever develops this disease, I will take it to the vet for euthanasia as soon as it's quality of life suffers. Unless things have greatly changed since my experience, the constant vet visits trying to stabilize the blood sugar and the many complications of diabetes are too cruel. There is no cure, only fast or slow deterioration, and I am convinced that I tortured that cat trying to prolong it's life, albeit with the best intentions in the world. I now believe that euthanasia would be a kindness".
I know that like you, I would have never accepted to abandon my cat to a hospital(what would he have thought of me then
)Was it selfishness that you could not endure the torture of allowing your own soulmate to be left there, afraid, in a cage, unable to sleep or relax through the whines and howls of the other strange suffering animals there, lame, ill, poked for glucose curves etc... I know like you I was afraid to put him through all of these things and would have been dangerously despondent from guilt, had he died in a strange place with strange people thinking I had abandonned him because he was sick. One of my vets had a cat, only 7 years old, who got a tumor in her nose, the vet
took her 150 miles away to be treated for a month of radiation, then her cat came back and died about a month later, she herself told me that this made her feel very guilty because when she took her cat, she was still hunting in her garden, when she came back she just lay and died, as such her hunting was curtailed by medical interventions that didn't help her at all. WE have at our disposal an impressive amount of choice, the answers to these choices are ours and ours only, how dare anyone call a decision selfish when one hasn't been there to see, to evaluate, to sense and to feel. The thing is we never can know if the decision was best, but only we have the choice and chose we must, we try and chose where our heart is, that should be respected
as much as we respect others for agreeing to 'inflict' any kind of treatment on their pets. We have to respect their choices even though we ourselves could never want our animals to suffer like that.
I do think that in my case, I erred in putting him to sleep. I thought he was despondent, I thought he was so sick he didn't want to go on, during the last hour I realized he was greatly disappointed that I had chosen to end his life. I admit it was a mistake, but with the best intentions, made out of love. And I still wonder if the other options could have turned out to be just as bad if not worse. If anyone wants to berate me for my decision with Yukon, I'm fair game, I have put so much reflection into this, each minute of life has been assimilating this for the last 16 moths now, I am strong and able to put up with this at this time, but if you had done this only weeks after I put my Yukon to sleep I might not have survived this, no kidding.
QUOTE (LoveThem @ Mar 3 2008, 01:13 AM)
I don't understand this post. You mention putting him down because you did not want to come home and find him dead or in a coma whereas your previous posts said you gave him to people who could give him the care he needed.
I thought he would need a high level of managed care, so one of the vet techs agreed to take him and care of him until he at least got stable. but when I heard he wasn't doing well (and plus i was sick w/o him...worried constantly about him and his emotional state not being in his normal surroundings) i went and got him. When i got him, went back to the vet..he wasn't doing well and after talking to a variety of vets who all suspected he had cancer too...is when I decided to put him down.
toonie, thanks for your sweet email. I made the best decision for my cat, he wasn't doing well and other things were going on (cancer was suspected). I didn't want him put through any more torture. he had been thru enough poor baby. I also believe quality of life is far more important than quant*ity. i know if we had kept him alive his quality of life would have been terrible. I know my decision was the best for my cat, although I miss him I am at peace becasue he isn't suffering anymore.
thanks for your post and words of encouragement.
thanks for your post and words of encouragement.
I remember this post you put in this form on 2/23 in a new topic in this Section. Perhaps others didn't see it.
You said:
"Hi all, I just posted on the sick pet area but thought I should do it here too and although my cat didn't die, I feel like he did and am grieving the loss just the same. My cat was sick last week and although he can live many more happy years he is going to require close monitoring and managed care. My work/school schedule does not allow me to be home much and I couldn't care for him the way he needs. So, I found another home for him where he will be given wonderful care. I just miss him and am so sad. I have had pets my whole life and have had them until their end (they either died of natural causes or I had to have them put to sleep). I have never given a pet up before and it breaks my heart. I just was trying to do what was in my cat's best interest. So hard...."
I wanted to read your WHOLE story so I read: in Pet Disease "had to give pet up for adoption". I read in the Death Forum "Gave Sick Cat up for adoption" (where you mention you considered he was at a "retirement home for cats"). I also read in Death Forum "My Boy is gone" and then lastly read here this topic "Thanks for your Support". As I said, after reading all these posts and everything you said, I still say your post here confuses me. Maybe others may not bother to read the whole story as I did because the parts that confused me are not referred to..as part of the whole story. In particular I reread the above post you did that I just quoted here. Again, it is confusing as it stands.
You said:
"Hi all, I just posted on the sick pet area but thought I should do it here too and although my cat didn't die, I feel like he did and am grieving the loss just the same. My cat was sick last week and although he can live many more happy years he is going to require close monitoring and managed care. My work/school schedule does not allow me to be home much and I couldn't care for him the way he needs. So, I found another home for him where he will be given wonderful care. I just miss him and am so sad. I have had pets my whole life and have had them until their end (they either died of natural causes or I had to have them put to sleep). I have never given a pet up before and it breaks my heart. I just was trying to do what was in my cat's best interest. So hard...."
I wanted to read your WHOLE story so I read: in Pet Disease "had to give pet up for adoption". I read in the Death Forum "Gave Sick Cat up for adoption" (where you mention you considered he was at a "retirement home for cats"). I also read in Death Forum "My Boy is gone" and then lastly read here this topic "Thanks for your Support". As I said, after reading all these posts and everything you said, I still say your post here confuses me. Maybe others may not bother to read the whole story as I did because the parts that confused me are not referred to..as part of the whole story. In particular I reread the above post you did that I just quoted here. Again, it is confusing as it stands.
Throwing stones and ganging up against someone very vulnerable at this time in her life is proof positive that humans are the worst species.
First I would like to say how sorry I am about Max passing. Whenever we lose someone that is so loved it is quite difficult to deal with.
Because I had read the original posting and subsequent postings in 4 different areas I can understand why some others may have had difficulty following your story and the changes you had made regarding the care of Max. Ultimately you made a decision that was yours to make and I am sure you made that decision out of love for Max.
Sometimes it is difficult to understand what someone is trying to say when our contact with each other is not in person and we try and write our thoughts down here.
I don't think anybody is here to judge you or chastise you in any way. From my perspective I see that responses came from the question that was asked in your posting here. It is easier to follow a continuing story when it is in one thread.
Nobody shoud be jumping to conclusions on what anybody else meant in their reply. And if there is a question perhaps we can ask for someone to clear up the confusion or ask anything. Also, I don't think anybody is ganging up on others.
We all have our own perspectives on different subject matter and should respect each other in every way.
As you grieve and miss Max I wish you peace and love as well as understanding, Cheri.
Many hugs to you ..........Beth
Because I had read the original posting and subsequent postings in 4 different areas I can understand why some others may have had difficulty following your story and the changes you had made regarding the care of Max. Ultimately you made a decision that was yours to make and I am sure you made that decision out of love for Max.
Sometimes it is difficult to understand what someone is trying to say when our contact with each other is not in person and we try and write our thoughts down here.
I don't think anybody is here to judge you or chastise you in any way. From my perspective I see that responses came from the question that was asked in your posting here. It is easier to follow a continuing story when it is in one thread.
Nobody shoud be jumping to conclusions on what anybody else meant in their reply. And if there is a question perhaps we can ask for someone to clear up the confusion or ask anything. Also, I don't think anybody is ganging up on others.
We all have our own perspectives on different subject matter and should respect each other in every way.
As you grieve and miss Max I wish you peace and love as well as understanding, Cheri.
Many hugs to you ..........Beth
Goliath, you may be an angel sent on earth to make peace, see what our pets do through us, from the heart. I apologize if I mistook statements that have been made for condemnation. I felt so strongly that I needed to protect Catlover because I have been on that desperate road. Not all of us feel the same way about what is best for an animal. We all want the best but our idea of the best differs. In my case sending my cat to be operated on would have been an immense stress (my cat was so depressed after his first vet visits that I then undertook to have him visited at home for as long as I could )and i think you also have to assess how much of all these processes will be accepted and understood by the pet before you permit this to happen to them. We are all different and I agree none of us has the 'right way' but some are a lot more at ease with medical interventions on animals than others. At one point I read Joanne saying (I think, I don't have the text here)that she would love to get dyalisis machines for all our furry babies and you see there I could not permit to let my cat suffering under one of these things. A human can understand and even then some
(was it Art Buchwald)chose to die instead of this continuous medical treatment but an animal ....?we have only one right way and that is our way.
Love Them and Joanne I have here some of your posts that led me astray sorry if you werent judging or chatizing.
(was it Art Buchwald)chose to die instead of this continuous medical treatment but an animal ....?we have only one right way and that is our way.
Love Them and Joanne I have here some of your posts that led me astray sorry if you werent judging or chatizing.
QUOTE
Posted on: Mar 2 2008, 03:25 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi, Joanne:
I hope Lily is okay and Charlie too. And, I know you have to keep an eye out for Mario to see he doesn't get into anything he shouldn't. It has to be hard to prepare to move and do all you are doing at the same time but I know you always put your babies first which should be an example for the people we discussed who seem to put their own needs before the furbaby.
But then to learn from an example, one has to open their mind and be aware of what they are doing and maybe some people are incapable of doing that. Maybe that explains why they seem able to put down an animal without any guilt even though there may be hope for it...or at least give it a chance to have some quality through the help of others if that is available. That has to be the very height of selfishness and the sad part is....people like that appear unable to see that. They are sometimes more concerned with making themselves feel better than doing the right thing for the pet. I can't help share the pain of "grieving" in such a situation.
Sorry about the soapbox again but I consider putting an animal down as a last resort and not to relieve any feelings of guilt. How many of us wish we could have our babies back with a quality of life that we could help them get so they could be with us longer? We didn't have that help available so the decision was not really our choice but it was what we HAD to do because we did love them so much. Oops..there I go again.
Take Care and keep us updated on your special ones.
Posted on: Mar 1 2008, 12:26 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi, Joanne: If Jim is sending you pictures attached to an email...there should be an image file just like the ones you scanned. You would need to make sure the size is scaled down if it is too big but you don't need to print out a copy and scan that copy. You really could just use the image file he sends you. If you look at the picture on your monitor and it fills the screen then use your Photo program to resize it down to like 400x300 in size.
As far as Mew and Howard...it is so true we don't want to let go until we have to but the key is to figure out WHEN.....we wind up asking ourselves..are we putting off a decision because WE don't want to let them go even though deep down we are sure their quality of life has been gone for a while OR because we truly feel they stilll have a decent amount of quality left and each day we can hug them is so precious to us and to them that we are comfortable putting it off.
You said "It's very hard to let the pain go." You have gone through all this before and so have I and I think we can both agree that the pain NEVER goes away. It gets pushed down, hopefully under good memories and a sort of healing...but at any time and on any day...it can suddenly jump up and overwhelm us..sometimes without warning and often as a result of a tiny trigger of some kind. BUT even though it is there...what we try to do is go on positively and through the love of our new or other babies, we can smile again at times and feel some peace within ourselves.
They are all our responsibility and they all deserve our love and attention and it can be good that we can't always pay attention and also grieve at the same identical moment in time. Your new kitten, Mario, reminds of this.....he makes you and me laugh about his antics....that is so much a part of the healing process. Those are the moments the pain can't coexist with and laughter is so healthy for humans.
What you said about not understanding some people...I totally agree with. When we accept one of these babies, we accept a certain responsibility to them not to us.
If they need care and we can't give it....if we can find a way for them to get it..that is our responsibility to them. They come first...and the final decision for them to leave should never be done for the wrong reasons...reasons that are selfish to us and are putting our feelings ahead of theirs. That's the only unconditional love we can give them and if we can't do that.....it would be better for us not to bring them home.
I have read more than once about what seems to be a questionable decision and get the impression the decision was made to relieve the owner of any guilt rather than helping the baby. It hurts to read those writings.
Well, I'll get off my soapbox for now. Good to see you here again and keep us updated on your babies and moving and we will look forward to the pictures you are planning to post.
I know you have had such sadness lately with your babies in especially such a short time but I do want you to know I feel you always did the best you could and undertook a tremendous amount of nursing I don't think I am capable of, which has helped so much and especially look at Charlie now...what a beautiful miracle. The sickness that come, especially with senior babies, we can't control but I believe you have always gone that extra miracle because of your love for your babies and they know it. They could never make the final decision...you had to and you have to out of love. It is never ever an easy decision and we can try and wonder if we did right but deep down we know we never take that decision lightly and never make it easily and that alone tells you, you did the right thing. Your babies are very lucky to have someone like you looking after them. I know it is so hard for you at times but you have done so much good for them...never forget that.
Hugs to you and keep us posted.
LoveThem
Forum: Death and Dying Pet Support Post Preview: #36604Posted on: Mar 2 2008, 10:15 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi Judy
Always nice to hear from you. I want to address some of the things that you have brought up. I believe you have addressed some very key items. And I don't want to let them go without a few comments on my part too.
<<< I know you always put your babies first which should be an example for the people we discussed who seem to put their own needs before the furbaby.>>
I have tried to always put my babies first. As you know, I will always carry guilt about my Rassy Cat for believing and trusting I had a good vet. As you know, he turned out to be a mercenary....I would stress the importance to anyone who had a sick baby to get a second opinion. Sure, an animal may have a terminal disease, but the issue is being able to keep the little one going with a comfortable quality of life until there is nothing left. You and I both know about that too. We do everything we can and then sometimes, wonder if there might have been something else.....perhaps with Rassy, had I have known, I could have extended his life a little longer.
<<<< That has to be the very height of selfishness and the sad part is....people like that appear unable to see that.>>>>>
There are those of us who fight, pray, bargin, etc, to extend our babies lives....Then there are those who just don't care maybe, or think its that big of a deal.....And then there are some who may not be able to afford it. I can only tell you, the last couple of months for us was rough. We put our babies first and as a result sacrificed doing things we enjoyed because the money went to the kids. I have been told that I am foolish...Well, my response, to each his own..and when your human kid gets sick, perhaps you are being foolish throwing money out of them too......
<<How many of us wish we could have our babies back with a quality of life that we could help them get so they could be with us longer? We didn't have that help available so the decision was not really our choice but it was what we HAD to do because we did love them so much. >>.
I play this tune over and over in my head all the time. I remember the night I had to put Rassy down. Now I just have many blue days. And then, there are Howard and mew. There quality of life went downhill. I did manage to extend their lives for a few more months. Like you Judy, we did everything we could....I couldn't bare thinking of Rassy having seizures. Mew was starving herself and Howard along with his kidney disease was dying from depression over his buddy Rassy Cat. I lost three babies within three months. And the last thing I ever dreamed of was having to put them down....but worse was watching them suffer. I remember one day when I was at the vet, some guy (jerk) had his wife's cat put down because the cat a mild form of treatable diabetes. The vet had no choice. Its hard on the vets when they know that some of these babies can be treated but their owners consider them not to be worth very much...... Well, perhaps, karma does rule, and in another lifetime, they get what they give......
Joanne
Forum: Death and Dying Pet Support Post Preview: #3662Posted on: Mar 1 2008, 05:11 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi Judy
thank you for your kind thoughts. You know how hard some days can be. I was out doing some errands and met another person who new of the killer vet. She told me about another crappy vet she went to who caused her baby to have a heart attack. He is ok now...but that vet is still practicing. She told me about some of the other horror stories too. I hope when we move, I am able to find a good vet. I know what I don't want. I was going to take the pictures Jim sends me to Target and print them off on their machine so that it would come out on that nice photo paper. Then I was going to frame them. Then I was going to scan a few and see how Mew comes out.
I took Lily to the vet early this am. She might be developing another upper resp. again. She goes through this every year. It stems back to when she was a kitten and I rescued her from an adoption agency. They had no idea of how sick she was. She appeared to be sleeping in the cage. When we got her home, I remember how labored her breathing was. She was so conjested. Well, I knew, she was also dehydrating. so, I rushed her to emerg. I ended up taking her Sat and sun. Then we had a follow up with the vet. We got her nursed back to health. She was one sick kitty. I think that has left her with a tendency to develop upper resp every year.
I also noticed that Charlie doesn't seem to be eating like he should. I opened some tuna and gave him some water off the can and a very tiny amount of tuna. Then I went to Petco and got some solid gold tuna for cats. I also got some greenies. Well, He picks etc. I sure hope he isn't coming down with fatty liver again. I will be watching him all day today and tomorrow.
I gave Mario two greenies. He is itching....I can't believe two tiny pieces would set his allergy into orbit. He just wants so much to eat what he can't. Moose loves those treats. They are supposed to be good for their teeth.
You know when you talk about people who get animals to relieve their own guilt, I wonder if they know the difference between their guilt and the real reasons for adopting a baby. I believe that some people are just toooooo warped to know. I also know, that there is no such thing a free animal. And when people decide to take on the responsiblity of getting a pet baby, they need to understand that these little ones are no different than humans. Yet, in our society, we are taught to believe, its ok to throw animals out......(in different ways) Its not ok. Its ignorance on the part of those who think they are just so superior to all the other creatures on earth.
To those who remanin silent who are out there doing all they can, they are the ones who deserve our praise. They are the ones who are silent. They don't require attention etc. They do their rescuing out of love. They truly understand the tenderness of a kind heart and a gentle touch.
thanks again for your kind thoughts.
Joanne
Forum: Death and Dying Pet Support Post Preview: #36610
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi, Joanne:
I hope Lily is okay and Charlie too. And, I know you have to keep an eye out for Mario to see he doesn't get into anything he shouldn't. It has to be hard to prepare to move and do all you are doing at the same time but I know you always put your babies first which should be an example for the people we discussed who seem to put their own needs before the furbaby.
But then to learn from an example, one has to open their mind and be aware of what they are doing and maybe some people are incapable of doing that. Maybe that explains why they seem able to put down an animal without any guilt even though there may be hope for it...or at least give it a chance to have some quality through the help of others if that is available. That has to be the very height of selfishness and the sad part is....people like that appear unable to see that. They are sometimes more concerned with making themselves feel better than doing the right thing for the pet. I can't help share the pain of "grieving" in such a situation.
Sorry about the soapbox again but I consider putting an animal down as a last resort and not to relieve any feelings of guilt. How many of us wish we could have our babies back with a quality of life that we could help them get so they could be with us longer? We didn't have that help available so the decision was not really our choice but it was what we HAD to do because we did love them so much. Oops..there I go again.
Take Care and keep us updated on your special ones.
Posted on: Mar 1 2008, 12:26 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi, Joanne: If Jim is sending you pictures attached to an email...there should be an image file just like the ones you scanned. You would need to make sure the size is scaled down if it is too big but you don't need to print out a copy and scan that copy. You really could just use the image file he sends you. If you look at the picture on your monitor and it fills the screen then use your Photo program to resize it down to like 400x300 in size.
As far as Mew and Howard...it is so true we don't want to let go until we have to but the key is to figure out WHEN.....we wind up asking ourselves..are we putting off a decision because WE don't want to let them go even though deep down we are sure their quality of life has been gone for a while OR because we truly feel they stilll have a decent amount of quality left and each day we can hug them is so precious to us and to them that we are comfortable putting it off.
You said "It's very hard to let the pain go." You have gone through all this before and so have I and I think we can both agree that the pain NEVER goes away. It gets pushed down, hopefully under good memories and a sort of healing...but at any time and on any day...it can suddenly jump up and overwhelm us..sometimes without warning and often as a result of a tiny trigger of some kind. BUT even though it is there...what we try to do is go on positively and through the love of our new or other babies, we can smile again at times and feel some peace within ourselves.
They are all our responsibility and they all deserve our love and attention and it can be good that we can't always pay attention and also grieve at the same identical moment in time. Your new kitten, Mario, reminds of this.....he makes you and me laugh about his antics....that is so much a part of the healing process. Those are the moments the pain can't coexist with and laughter is so healthy for humans.
What you said about not understanding some people...I totally agree with. When we accept one of these babies, we accept a certain responsibility to them not to us.
If they need care and we can't give it....if we can find a way for them to get it..that is our responsibility to them. They come first...and the final decision for them to leave should never be done for the wrong reasons...reasons that are selfish to us and are putting our feelings ahead of theirs. That's the only unconditional love we can give them and if we can't do that.....it would be better for us not to bring them home.
I have read more than once about what seems to be a questionable decision and get the impression the decision was made to relieve the owner of any guilt rather than helping the baby. It hurts to read those writings.
Well, I'll get off my soapbox for now. Good to see you here again and keep us updated on your babies and moving and we will look forward to the pictures you are planning to post.
I know you have had such sadness lately with your babies in especially such a short time but I do want you to know I feel you always did the best you could and undertook a tremendous amount of nursing I don't think I am capable of, which has helped so much and especially look at Charlie now...what a beautiful miracle. The sickness that come, especially with senior babies, we can't control but I believe you have always gone that extra miracle because of your love for your babies and they know it. They could never make the final decision...you had to and you have to out of love. It is never ever an easy decision and we can try and wonder if we did right but deep down we know we never take that decision lightly and never make it easily and that alone tells you, you did the right thing. Your babies are very lucky to have someone like you looking after them. I know it is so hard for you at times but you have done so much good for them...never forget that.
Hugs to you and keep us posted.
LoveThem
Forum: Death and Dying Pet Support Post Preview: #36604Posted on: Mar 2 2008, 10:15 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi Judy
Always nice to hear from you. I want to address some of the things that you have brought up. I believe you have addressed some very key items. And I don't want to let them go without a few comments on my part too.
<<< I know you always put your babies first which should be an example for the people we discussed who seem to put their own needs before the furbaby.>>
I have tried to always put my babies first. As you know, I will always carry guilt about my Rassy Cat for believing and trusting I had a good vet. As you know, he turned out to be a mercenary....I would stress the importance to anyone who had a sick baby to get a second opinion. Sure, an animal may have a terminal disease, but the issue is being able to keep the little one going with a comfortable quality of life until there is nothing left. You and I both know about that too. We do everything we can and then sometimes, wonder if there might have been something else.....perhaps with Rassy, had I have known, I could have extended his life a little longer.
<<<< That has to be the very height of selfishness and the sad part is....people like that appear unable to see that.>>>>>
There are those of us who fight, pray, bargin, etc, to extend our babies lives....Then there are those who just don't care maybe, or think its that big of a deal.....And then there are some who may not be able to afford it. I can only tell you, the last couple of months for us was rough. We put our babies first and as a result sacrificed doing things we enjoyed because the money went to the kids. I have been told that I am foolish...Well, my response, to each his own..and when your human kid gets sick, perhaps you are being foolish throwing money out of them too......
<<How many of us wish we could have our babies back with a quality of life that we could help them get so they could be with us longer? We didn't have that help available so the decision was not really our choice but it was what we HAD to do because we did love them so much. >>.
I play this tune over and over in my head all the time. I remember the night I had to put Rassy down. Now I just have many blue days. And then, there are Howard and mew. There quality of life went downhill. I did manage to extend their lives for a few more months. Like you Judy, we did everything we could....I couldn't bare thinking of Rassy having seizures. Mew was starving herself and Howard along with his kidney disease was dying from depression over his buddy Rassy Cat. I lost three babies within three months. And the last thing I ever dreamed of was having to put them down....but worse was watching them suffer. I remember one day when I was at the vet, some guy (jerk) had his wife's cat put down because the cat a mild form of treatable diabetes. The vet had no choice. Its hard on the vets when they know that some of these babies can be treated but their owners consider them not to be worth very much...... Well, perhaps, karma does rule, and in another lifetime, they get what they give......
Joanne
Forum: Death and Dying Pet Support Post Preview: #3662Posted on: Mar 1 2008, 05:11 PM
Replies: 289
Views: 2,602 Hi Judy
thank you for your kind thoughts. You know how hard some days can be. I was out doing some errands and met another person who new of the killer vet. She told me about another crappy vet she went to who caused her baby to have a heart attack. He is ok now...but that vet is still practicing. She told me about some of the other horror stories too. I hope when we move, I am able to find a good vet. I know what I don't want. I was going to take the pictures Jim sends me to Target and print them off on their machine so that it would come out on that nice photo paper. Then I was going to frame them. Then I was going to scan a few and see how Mew comes out.
I took Lily to the vet early this am. She might be developing another upper resp. again. She goes through this every year. It stems back to when she was a kitten and I rescued her from an adoption agency. They had no idea of how sick she was. She appeared to be sleeping in the cage. When we got her home, I remember how labored her breathing was. She was so conjested. Well, I knew, she was also dehydrating. so, I rushed her to emerg. I ended up taking her Sat and sun. Then we had a follow up with the vet. We got her nursed back to health. She was one sick kitty. I think that has left her with a tendency to develop upper resp every year.
I also noticed that Charlie doesn't seem to be eating like he should. I opened some tuna and gave him some water off the can and a very tiny amount of tuna. Then I went to Petco and got some solid gold tuna for cats. I also got some greenies. Well, He picks etc. I sure hope he isn't coming down with fatty liver again. I will be watching him all day today and tomorrow.
I gave Mario two greenies. He is itching....I can't believe two tiny pieces would set his allergy into orbit. He just wants so much to eat what he can't. Moose loves those treats. They are supposed to be good for their teeth.
You know when you talk about people who get animals to relieve their own guilt, I wonder if they know the difference between their guilt and the real reasons for adopting a baby. I believe that some people are just toooooo warped to know. I also know, that there is no such thing a free animal. And when people decide to take on the responsiblity of getting a pet baby, they need to understand that these little ones are no different than humans. Yet, in our society, we are taught to believe, its ok to throw animals out......(in different ways) Its not ok. Its ignorance on the part of those who think they are just so superior to all the other creatures on earth.
To those who remanin silent who are out there doing all they can, they are the ones who deserve our praise. They are the ones who are silent. They don't require attention etc. They do their rescuing out of love. They truly understand the tenderness of a kind heart and a gentle touch.
thanks again for your kind thoughts.
Joanne
Forum: Death and Dying Pet Support Post Preview: #36610
hi, there, 
i am still not able to "quote"
so, Goliath, you make peace on earth
and toonie, i understand your feeling about protecting catlover
and Love Them
and jackjackbojack
i do know that you are really pet-lovers, though i cannot follow every thread,
not enough time
so catlover2, I am very sorry that Max had to leave
please, forgive my bad language
but i just wanted to share my thoughts
i am glad, that it looks like this thread will have an happy ending
katzen11
i am still not able to "quote"
so, Goliath, you make peace on earth
and toonie, i understand your feeling about protecting catlover
and Love Them
and jackjackbojack
i do know that you are really pet-lovers, though i cannot follow every thread,
not enough time
so catlover2, I am very sorry that Max had to leave
please, forgive my bad language
but i just wanted to share my thoughts
i am glad, that it looks like this thread will have an happy ending
katzen11
LOL Katzen you said it best. Love ya girlfriend! 
Joanne, if you and Love Them weren't judging Cat lover when you were discussing 'some people', I definitely owe you a huge apology so here it is. If it wasn't Cat Lover you were berating with the comments that you made during this time, it is unfortunate that the "some people" you talked about in the above posts happened to sound very much like Cat Lover. It makes me very sad to feel like I am one of the 'some people' but at least I don't think you will have pushed me into a dangerous situation. Thank God that when I came here at the start, after grieving for over 100 days and yes, feeling so guilty for a decision that was taken when I may have been out of touch with reality, that no one made me feel worse than I already did, I so needed your grace, I might not have been able to carry on and might not have lived to see Cat Lover's story which is so much like mine. I suppose I don't belong here and this is what was needed to show me the way out. Thanks to all of you who were so so kind, it is a lifelong lesson,
thanks you oldies but goodies, I'm thinking of all of you who shared my grief and how precious you were. Those of you who assist your pets until the very last minute, you are wonderful. Those of us who could not do as good, please have mercy on us.
Take care and au revoir.
thanks you oldies but goodies, I'm thinking of all of you who shared my grief and how precious you were. Those of you who assist your pets until the very last minute, you are wonderful. Those of us who could not do as good, please have mercy on us.
Take care and au revoir.
so, maybe this belongs to another thread
or maybe some of all the other people, who got so well-cherished-posts
by toonie, can find better words than i do
but i feel so terribly sorry that toonie wants to leave the LS-community
with the feeling, she does not belong here
katzen11
or maybe some of all the other people, who got so well-cherished-posts
by toonie, can find better words than i do
but i feel so terribly sorry that toonie wants to leave the LS-community
with the feeling, she does not belong here
katzen11
Not so fast Toonie, you are not quitting just yet.
For someone whose words are so well respected around here you most certainly do belong here so don't you go forgetting that. The door will always be open for you at LS. You do have a place here, and there will be many members to come who will be needing your great words of wisdom and encouragement that you have shown to so many before.
Please do not leave otherwise LS will not be the same again and let it be known, you are a valued and treasured member here and not one we would like to loose in a hurry.
You have a heart of gold and its radiance shines through in your words..........
COME BACK TOONIE!!!!!
For someone whose words are so well respected around here you most certainly do belong here so don't you go forgetting that. The door will always be open for you at LS. You do have a place here, and there will be many members to come who will be needing your great words of wisdom and encouragement that you have shown to so many before.
Please do not leave otherwise LS will not be the same again and let it be known, you are a valued and treasured member here and not one we would like to loose in a hurry.
You have a heart of gold and its radiance shines through in your words..........
COME BACK TOONIE!!!!!
As I reflect back to the original posting here, I am sad that the cry for comfort by catlover was lost in most of the replies. I do not want anybody to leave this wonderful and comforting forum where we all should be taking care of each others pain and sorrow and helping them get to a more comfortable place in healing. Isn't that why we all came here? Didn't we all come here to find some sort of peace, comfort, and understanding?
Poor Max. Can you imagine how he must feel?
Perhaps if there are things of a personal nature that someone feels the need to say to another writer, they could use a private message or another place besides here.
Can we please just let Max rest in peace???
For you catlover, I wish you comfort in finding resolution in your grief and sorrow and I will continue to hope that we can all learn to respect each others views and walk together in harmony.
Much love to all of you here.....Beth
Poor Max. Can you imagine how he must feel?
Perhaps if there are things of a personal nature that someone feels the need to say to another writer, they could use a private message or another place besides here.
Can we please just let Max rest in peace???
For you catlover, I wish you comfort in finding resolution in your grief and sorrow and I will continue to hope that we can all learn to respect each others views and walk together in harmony.
Much love to all of you here.....Beth
everyone please relax, there is no reason for anybody to leave unless they really want to leave. we all have the right to opinion, but keep it kind.
emotions often run high around here, many times in fact during the 12+ years online. it is the nature of the grieving process. so keep the spirit of the forum in mind when you post.
emotions often run high around here, many times in fact during the 12+ years online. it is the nature of the grieving process. so keep the spirit of the forum in mind when you post.
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