To Everyone Here:

"U Gatta Watch This Video Is About Shelters"

was temporarily moved and closed until such time that the Administrator for Lightning-Strike could watch the video, and read all responses.

Lightning-Strike is a place where people can come to grieve & to talk to others who are going through a
terrible time regarding the loss of their pet(s).

That is what MD created this board for, "in Tribbles memory"......(MD's beautiful furkitty)....

"U Gatta Watch This Video Is About Shelters" would much better be received at an ANIMAL RIGHTS GROUP BOARD, where people are not coming for comfort and for grieving over their beloved animals -- which is the SOLE REASON THAT LIGHTNING-STRIKE WAS STARTED!

When MD (LS Administrator) returns, he can then make the decision as to whether or not he would like to return "U Gatta Watch This Video Is About Shelters" to the Death & Dying Section of Lightning-Strike.

if there are any comments on this, please let's hear them.

i must admit i am in a quandry on how i feel about this video. on one hand, it does deal with pet loss due to the throw-away nature of our society
regarding the responsiblity of our animals. on the other, however, i feel that the content may be too strong for our members here who are trying
to heal because the photos shown at the end of the video are quite graphic.

i see the owner of the video has reposted her link in the links section, i will leave the link intact but will post a caveat in the subject line and post for now.

Well i must admit i didnt look, its not a case of turning a blind eye, i do my share of letters and donations through Peta.

To be honest at one stage in my life i 'hated' the human race and therefore in order to keep my sanity in tact i avoid having to actual see this type of film/pictures but agree that these people need to be exposed and the human race needs to have its eyes opened.

I feel very strongly about this video being able to be seen. It does not show any animals being euthanized. It does, however, show their bodies layed in rows, and filling several garbage cans at the very end of the clip, to reflect the numbers of those that are dying each day..that they are not just statistics, it is reality. It is so easy for people to be able to pretend it doesn't exist by turning away from it, but it does exist, and needs to be viewed by anyone who is an animal lover, which I would assume we all are since we are here. It is only trying to educate people about spaying & neutering, and being a responsible pet owner. Some people out there are just ignorant in the dictionary sense of the word. They love their dog/cat, and although they don't think of it as such, if they are breeding their dog/cat, even if it is a purebred, they are part of the problem...period. I think many people would be shocked at the number of purebred dogs that are in shelters. I just wish everyone knew the health risks they were taking with their pets lives if they don't spay/neuter. My pets are my children and I want them to be healthy above all else....and they can't be their healthiest...or live their longest...unless they are spayed. I can't remember where the vet I work for said the info. came from, but there were very extensive studies ( the same ones that have proven it is more beneficial to have your animal spayed before her first heat cycle/6 months) that stated with every litter your animal has, its life is depleted by an average of 7.5 months. Each day with my babies is too precious to me to throw away a single one. Please allow this video to continue to be shown. If someone doesn't want to see the dead babies, then they should cut it off at the point, near the end, where the veterinarian is talking. It is only after he begins to speak that the bodies are ever shown.
I would like to add that this video could be very beneficial to not only our furbabies, but those grieving as well. There are so many people out there that feel like they really are ready to get another furbaby, but just can't bring themselves to do it. If they see what a need there is for these furbabies to be loved by someone, it just might be what they need to "go for it", and then everyone wins! There is nothing like the love of a grateful rescue dog to help a broken heart mend.
Thank you for your consideration,
Kim

have to admit though seeing the animals at the end was disturbing, what choked me up the most was the technicians crying at having to do the "deed." the
vet near the end said he had euthanized thousands of animals in his career...man, that's got to keep one up at night

Having been an animal shelter volunteer for many years, I can say from experience, it does keep one up at night. I haven't been a part of thousands, but I would guess the numbers are in the hundreds, and those techs speak the truth when they say it doesn't get any easier to deal with. My shelter, because we are rural, is not quite as over run as the one in the clip and is a little more flexible on the number of days we keep them, depending on available space, temperment ( we will double them up in cages if they get along), age, health, and unfortunately, "cuteness".(Those running the shelter say the cuter ones are more adoptable, and unfortunately they are right. I say beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and I would take personality over looks any day, but, most won't.) Anyways, it is beyond words to tell you the feeling of looking on the "list" and seeing one you really like on it. There have been a few times where I was able to convince them to give a certain dog more time, but that just meant another was bumped up in its place, so my feeling of victory soon turns to defeat. It is heartbreaking, and I often just feel hopeless. We have "D-Day" ,as we call it, once a week, and I always boil a few chickens the night before and bring in the meat to divide between all those on the "list" so they can have one last act of love given to them before they go. It's not much, but it's something.
Kim

Although I think that videos, stories, photos, etc. that focus peoples' attention on the terrible and truly shameful problem of pet overpopulation, providing a link to such here at a pet loss forum is not the appropriate place.

People come here so distraught they cannot think straight. Many get no support or sympathy in their circle of friends and working world, sometimes even their families fail them. This is a truly wonderful, heartfelt place to come to grieve, to cry, to pour out one's heart and literally be "lifted up" and consoled by precious, dear people who have experienced the heartache and grief first hand.

No, these videos and stories definitely have a place, but not here; not at this time.

--Susan
~ a voice for the voiceless ~

Kim,
I am a supporter and member of many organisations such as PETA, BUAV, Compassion in World Farming etc. and believe totally in the rights of animals to be treated with dignity and compassion at all times.

My problem with the link being placed on this site is, "wrong time", "wrong place".

Wrong Place because:
The people who seek out a site like Lightning Strike are ALREADY on the high end scale of animal lovers. If they didn't already have immense compassion for animals then they would never have arrived at this site in the first place They are already the kind of people who take in stray kittens, give homes to dogs from shelters, etc. doing their best to play a part in helping animals.
Placing the link here on this site is like trying to preach to the already converted.

Wrong Time because:
When people first arrive at this site, two things you can be absolutely sure of:
1. They are in deep emotional pain.
2. They are great animal lovers.

I don't think it is then right to cause even more emotional pain or distress to them by giving a link to a video such as this.

Kim I have the UTMOST RESPECT for you and your tireless pursuit in trying to educate people into understanding what goes on behind closed doors. I firmly believe it is the only way to get things changed.
If we all took a shelter animal then it would help and save so many animals who would otherwise be euthanised. But as I say above I just think it's the wrong time and the wrong place.

with love
jilly

Jilly,
I'm glad to see that you are helping in the fight for our animal friends, and I FULLY respect your opinion, however, I don't necessarily think that just being an animal lover automatically means people are fully educated on the issues of the importance of spaying and neutering. In my work as a vet tech, I constantly see people who treat their pets like royalty, and they are as loved and spoiled as any could be, yet they are still breeding them. I know all I can do is try to educate people on the issue, and the ultimate choice is obviosly up to them since it is their dog or cat, but I can't imagine these same people breeding their pets if they were aware of the health dangers involved, not only during the pregnancy, but long after (due to the hormones). If presented with the medical facts, I couldn't imagine these people being willing to trade months of their pets life for each of those litters of puppies.
With that said, l definately see your point about right time and place...no arguement there. I sometimes forget that not everyone is (thankfully) exposed to it in a way that I am....sadly enough, it is just part of my life. Thanks for responding in a way that could better make me see why this may not be the "right time, right place" .
Love,
Kim

im glad to see people are discussing this topic rationally, its the way support was meant to be

Hi Everyone,
Just had to put my own 2 cents in about this topic. I feel no need to watch this video as I already know full well what goes on behind closed doors ( and closed minds ) in regular shelters. This probably ISN'T the right place for already upset hearts, but on the other paw, education, knowledge and exposure will only HELP our animal companions in the long run...so I'm split, but AM glad this topic is out there now. Kim's right about even animal lovers not necessarily knowing enough about these things....or some just ignoring the overpopulation problems for selfish reasons. Although there can be other problems with badly-run ones (there's always a bad apple in every bunch!), this is why I ONLY support (proper) No Kill animal shelters now! If those in charge of mainstream shelters REALLY cared, they'd work to transition to No-Kills ASAP. There are so many of them growing and evolving in the States now, I feel there's no excuse anymore NOT to go this much more humane route.

Furkidlets mom,
I understand how you feel, and I hope for a day that we will no longer need to destroy any of our homeless babies. Unfortunately, there are just too many for all the shelters to be no kill shelters. They can only handle so many, then they stop taking any new ones which leaves them to go you know where...then others must be euthanized to make room for those and so on. At the shelter where I volunteer, we always get those people who say "well, we tried to take them to a no kill shelter, but they didn't have any room so we had to come here." No, they didn't have to go there, but they didn't want to do the responsible thing and find the animal a new home on their own..that is an inconvenience to them. If people would just be responsible for their pets we wouldn't have any problems.
I am just the opposite with my support being for those shelters who have no choice but to euthanize. I know those at the no kill shelters aren't going to die, those other babies don't have that same security. It isn't a choice at the shelter I volunteer at, trust me, it is just something that has to be done. There is just not enough room for all the animals that are abandoned and homeless..that is just the sad reality of it. This just seals it for me that people just truly don't know the severity of the problem...If you had any idea the numbers of animals that are homeless, you would know that all shelters being no kill shelters is a fantasy.
Kim

Dear Kim R.,
I can agree that so far there aren't enough no-kill shelters to accomodate all the abandoned/dumped animals, although I have to point out that since 1987, when the no-kill movement started (that's only 12 years), the figures of 17 million animals/year killed in shelters has dropped to 'only' 5 million...still an abomination, but in the right direction! However, far too many (I know from a friend who runs her own no-kill charity) people actually lie outright to both kill and no-kill establishments about steps they took or didn't take prior to their relinquishment of their animals. When my friend absolutely can't make more room (not very often) she does a number of things....uses the opportunity to try and impart upon people the fact that the animal's ultimate fate is in their hands (to discourage them from going to a kill facility), educates them on how to find a new home for the animal, and tries to use their inherent guilt (which SHOULD be there) to effect a change of heart in them. Many times she's been actively threatened by people saying they will just SHOOT the animal, or something else heinous, if she doesn't take them...this can follow the exposure of their deliberate lies about the animal in question....like,"It's not MINE! It's a stray!" etc, etc. These people know they're doing wrong, but won't face their irresponsible and heartless acts, at least not without a fight. When push comes to shove, she usually takes the animal anyway and scrambles to find a foster home, knowing she'll never get a donation in kind from those people, just for being honest and caring so deeply for the animals' lives. In the end, it is the abandoning and over-breeding of animals, one way or another, one excuse at a time, that makes for overpopulation. There is heartache from ALL those who strive to change this very inhumane attitude, no matter which sector they're in. In the final &%^ysis, I know I couldn't do the killing myself unless the animal was truly too sick to recover (yah, I know, another point of debate!), therefore I can't support it - that's just me listening to my own conscience. And no, I wouldn't expect anyone else to do it for my convenience, either. I've lived with a very restrictive lifestyle strictly for the sake of my own animals (my needs became secondary) because I believe so strongly in their intrinsic value.

I didn't really want to start a debate on this issue, so I would just recommend, for any interested in learning more about the ethical and procedural dilemmas, a few places to start your re-education would be:
The book "Disposable Animals" by Craig Brestrup; articles by Ed Duvin; the website for
Best Friends Animal Sanctuary. I do hope this discussion hasn't offended anyone, but I guess we all have our opinions and despite the numbers of unfeeling people out there, I still have great hope that basic attitudes can change for the better, given enough willing hearts to make it happen.

Please don't think that you are offending by giving your opinion. Whether we want people to adopt from no-kill shelters or kill shelters, we are fighting the same battle, so I don't see it as "different sides" at all, I just want people to rescue an animal instead of buying one...I don't care where they get it from, I just feel sorry for the ones that may die, and didn't have a choice as to which type of shelter they ended up in. I guess I should have elaborated when I said I support kill shelters. In this I meant that I encourage people to adopt from them for the reason I just stated, not that I think it is the "better" type of shelter. God knows I pray for the day that kill shelters are a thing of the past, I hate them, as necessary as they are right now. I very much want all shelters to be no kill shelters, nothing would make me happier, I just can't imagine it ever being a reality. When you consider that almost 5 million animals a year are killed, where can you house them all? I felt a sense of hope at the numbers you shared, I had no idea that the numbers had fallen so much. I do know that the numbers of people spaying/neutering their animals has gone up dramatically as well, as I'm sure that helps these numbers. It is all about education, and I think people are slowly getting it. I hope that one day we will have enough no-kill shelters to house all the homeless babies. Our city shelter, which is the one that I volunteer at, actually works very closely with the 3 no-kill shelters in our area. We all work together in the fight, and even they know that there are just too many, and sadly know that some must be euthanized. Unfortunately, man has created a bigger problem than he can handle, but maybe someday, those numbers will decline enough to make euthanization a thing of the past.
I'm sorry you took my response as a "sided" response. I was just saying that I feel sorry for the animals that may die, and want them to be adopted first. They didn't have a choice at which shelter they went to, and it is unfortunate they had to end up at one they may die at. It breaks my heart. There is just nowhere for them to go right now. We do the best we can, keep them as long as possible as long as they stay healthy (we have a little pit-bull mix that we have had for almost six months that is just so sweet, but noone wants him because of the stereotype), and as long as we have somewhere to put them. We have used donations to fill up every square inch of the property with runs, and even have some outside with doghouses, which is not ideal, but better than their alternative. We do all that we can, and get frusterated because it is never enough...they just keep coming!
Anyway, I am actually a huge fan of the Best Friends Animal Sanctuary and donate to them every month. They are one of the two places that receive quite a chunk of my monthly donations. The ASPCA is the other. Both of these places do an amazing job and have my full support. I wish all homeless animals could end up somewhere like that.
Kim
I just feel sick inside that you think that I "support" the killing of animals........ if you only knew me.